go to https://kbin.social/d/lemmynsfw.com and hit the block button if you don’t want posts from there in your feed
The kbin enhancement script is also a great little tool to completely hide anything originating from NSFW domains that’s listed in the script.
Close to? There are jurisdictions where that is straight-up illegal. In those jurisdictions, anyone who so much as loads a page containing such a post is guilty of a sex offense, because the uncensored image is in their browser cache and therefore in their possession.
So yes, if they’re allowing that content, then they need to be defederated with extreme prejudice.
This seemed odd to me, so I went to investigate. A clarification was posted 2 hours ago. Stating very clearly that:
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loli/shota are BANNED and not okay in any way.
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IRL kids are BANNED OBVIOUSLY because no shit.
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characters who are petite/young-looking but not obviously underage are ALLOWED because as an instance the votes decided that banning all of it was destructive, and differentiating between them can be impossible.
So, it seems like an anti-witch hunting measure, which has ironically caused a massive witch hunt for the instance as a whole. These guys don’t seem to in any way support pedophilia (thank God).
What an odd way to initially phrase it. Saying “underage-looking nsfw” is such an underhanded wording that it makes me feel like they were trying to stir up a shitstorm against their own userbase. The followup is way better “we’re allowing weebs, no loli, some of you might still think it looks underage but we’re leaving it at the mods’ discretion”. But the damage is already done.
He also called them “pleasures” in the initial post. That’s a really weird way to phrase it 🤔
Petite / young-looking but not obviously underage
That still might actually be illegal in some jurisdictions. The wording of the British law on it bans “pseudo photographs” of people who are underage, and the definition used would probably cover that.
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HARD DISAGREE
Another community having the possibility of posting something you don’t approve of when nothing is actually illegal, nobody is actually getting hurt, and you could just have blocked that community (or even just offending users) for yourself in the first place is just a really dumb reason to force the whole instance to defederate from it.
It’s up to Ernest what happens, but I’m not on board for unnecessary censorship of cartoons, of all things. I honestly worry for you.
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but I’m not on board for unnecessary censorship of cartoons
Said by every loli loving paedo.
It is actually illegal in some jurisdictions, including mine.
It probably is illegal in some jurisdictions, that’s the issue.
From the looks of it, kbin’s gonna need some stronger moderation to get rid of the fucking paedophiles.
As long as kbin domain blocking tools work, I can choose to block their content - and I will, because 1) it’s pretty fucking vile 2) it might be illegal. But I don’t need it to be defederated, I’m happier if I have the tools to deal with this (and other similar stuff).
I wish we could remove the The “Random Post” / “Random Thread” boxes from the front page. Those seem to display NSFW material quite often - I don’t really have any need for “random content” especially since I can’t control the source.
But I don’t need it to be defederated, I’m happier if I have the tools to deal with this (and other similar stuff).
I’m sorry but this is asinine. We’re not talking about blocking too many posts about Taylor Swift, we’re talking about new users of kbin getting fed illegal child porn in their feed.
Kbin should defederate immediately.
- it might be illegal.
Sounds like an existential risk to the server to federate with them unless they tighten things up then. @ernest is beholden to both the laws of where his server is hosted and where he lives, which I believe are Germany and Poland. If he violates either, there goes the instance and/or him.
For some reason, people from reddit would rather ban EVERYONE from accessing content, rather than just hitting the very-easy-to-use block button, that will take care of all of their woes while not forcing their opinion on everyone else.
Loli is fucking gross, and the people who enjoy it are gross, but the block button is right there.
If it “might be illegal” than there actually might be a legal responsibility to defederate. Federation is not links to content, it’s mirrors of content, and anything you’re seeing while browsing kbin.social is being hosted here.
As long as kbin domain blocking tools work,
Instance blocking.
As much as I enjoy the idea of an adult community, it has to be adult in both idea and implementation. Allowing depictions of underage people (especially in the age of AI) is plain stupid. I’m blocking lemmynsfw and suggest you all do the same.
There is a good case here to defederate every instance by default and only federate based on a white list.
There are criminals in the fediverse obviously and we should split from them immediately. Don’t forget that their content is copied to the servers of Ernest automatically.
Again, Beehaw defederated 380 instances and it’s not just because they disagree with their political stance, but mostly because of this kind of horrible content. Which will come from another new instance, and another, etc, etc. Which means that we need to update Ernest regularly to protect his servers. Or make the default setting as defederated.
Let’s flip that argument: should we all abide by American standards?
No. Kbin is Polish, I think
Yes, the developer of /kbin is Polish.
Lolicon is illegal in Poland.if this is indeed the case, then this is really the only valid reason to defederate. if it’s literally illegal to federate, then it’s understandable what must be done. otherwise? no.
So in your mind the only valid reason to not serve child porn to your users is if you happen to be subject to the laws of Poland at the time?
Comments like this alone make me want to leave kbin.
There’s like 3 different users with anime pfp going to bat for loli all over the different instances and it’s definitely annoying. Like nobody gives a shit that technically this or that. Most people don’t want to see it.
For real, I’ve been trying to learn Japanese on and off, love the country, like lot of its media (albeit not much anime) and I’m absolutely desperate to avoid being associated with those guys.
Most people who aren’t nonces recognise fairly instinctively that a sexual image of someone who appears to be a ten year old girl is a pretty noncey thing to both produce and look at, and that finding some level of sexual attraction to someone who looks like a ten year old is pretty noncey. But you know, weebs gonna weeb.
For sure m8. I imagine people like that probably don’t get outside much so they don’t realize how much distress their ‘preferences’ actually causes to your average person.
I think it’s just that they spend all their time around other people who get off to that shit so they think it’s normal and fine.
If something is truly harmful it should be illegal. and if it is illegal, it’s grounds to defederate. if something is not illegal and there’s no need to make it illegal, then it’s fine.
actual child porn is something that causes harm, and thus should be illegal, and thus grounds for defederation.
loli/shota are not child porn. these are words that apply to adults. if loli/shota content OF ADULTS is indeed banned in poland, and kbin is in poland and subject to those laws, then it’s understandable that defederation has to occur.
Something tells me though, that adult loli/shota content isn’t actually banned in poland. anti loli idiots have been trying to declare it’s cp for years now and they’re just wrong.
[Polish penal code] Article 202 § 4b penalizes the production, dissemination, presentation, storage or possession of pornographic content depicting the created or processed image of a minor under the age of 18 participating in a sexual activity.
It takes like 2 minutes to look up.
loli/shota do not refer to an age, and lemmynsfw has stated that they ban nsfw images of minors and those who appear underage.
I can’t say I know too much about it, but I was pretty sure shota was almost entirely dependent on one of the characters being in grade school or early middle school?
“Loli” can be ambiguous, but I think here it’s pretty clear it’s meant to refer to drawn characters with bodies typical of around the age of 10-13.
I don’t quite know where doujinshi of characters like Betty from Re:Zero would fall, since she’s established as quite old but also childlike in appearance and behavior.
So if I draw some random character having sex, and then label them as “15 years old”, it’s now illegal? What kind of insane nonsense is that?
I don’t know any case law, but probably!
I think it’s usually not too much of a legal concern, but it’s also not uncommon for people to draw lewds of characters from shows that are canonically underage (see: Prisma Ilya, who is 10/11 in that spinoff series, although “18” in other Fate series). That would certainly be illegal.
But either way, it definitely creeps people out, and it’s usually best to avoid doing things that make people want to stay away from you like that.
Ernest is Polish, and the server is in Germany. Which, for what it’s worth, is another reason why any Nazi shit also needs to to be blocked at the server level, too.
is another reason why any Nazi shit also needs to to be blocked at the server level, too.
It’s ok to block Nazi shit. Nazi ideology hurts real life people after all
@LollerCorleone thanks for that.
This is highly misleading and makes more sense when reading the original question thread.
https://kbin.social/m/lemmynsfw@lemmynsfw.com/t/42695/READ-THIS-clarification-on-the-decision-and-poll-resultsThis affects fictional content where it is hard to determine the age of the character. No obvious underage stuff.
I think it’s necessary to monitor the situation and how they will handle moderation, but for now, I would prefer to do it from a distance from kbin. There is currently a significant issue with moderation, and disturbing content can remain up for too long. I’m working on improving this issue as well.
I’m personally most worried about the toxicity of the western loli community. I had to deal with them as a moderator of anime communities, most famously an anime shitposting page on Facebook, and they’re the worst.
Yeah pedos tend to be shit people, whoda thunk it?
It’s not just that.
They think if you’re not a big fan of loli, then you don’t belong to the anime community, and you must be harassed out from there. If I had a dollar every time people were harassed on Twitter for saying they like some generic shounen instead of some borderline loli porn…
They do that, though, because they know reasonably well adjusted people will not tolerate their kinks in general fandom, so they have to make sure those people do not enter the fandom.
So they believe you need to be into their kink to be an anime fan not from an ideological position, but from one of knowing its the only way they get to be in the fandom.
Which is super fucked up.
I haven’t seen any user profile options to block nsfw tagged content, or to block a specific instance.
That would help, and doesn’t need defederation.
edit: found “Hide adult content” in settings.
Under “Settings”, “Hide adult content” is enabled by default.
In communities you have a little block icon next to the “Subscribe” button in the sidebar to block individual communities. The same rule goes for whole instances. In this case: https://kbin.social/d/lemmynsfw.com - I think it’s just a little hard to navigate directly to those URLs from within the kbin interface at the moment.deleted by creator
it’d be nice if you could write up a short thing on your philosophy for federating/defederating/content. many of us would like to simply have full federation and curate content ourselves, though it’s understandable that moderation needs to happen in some cases.
many of us would like to simply have full federation and curate content ourselves, though it’s understandable that moderation needs to happen in some cases.
Agreed. I think the emphasis needs to be on usage of NSFW tagging, and making sure users have the ability to block magazines that they think are borderline (or just bad at tagging their content) without having to click into that magazine.
That said, I would not be opposed to a middle ground where entire instances can be flagged as NSFW so that their content is automatically tagged. 1) Instances should be able to voluntarily tag themselves like this so that all posts originating from that instance are automatically tagged, and 2) admins of other instances should be given the option to flag other instances as NSFW to their local instance as an alternative to defederating. There is still some room for overreaction with #2, but it’s still putting control in the hands of that instance’s users whether they want to interact with that content or not.
This seems like a much more manageable approach. Obviously illegal content needs to be banned, but as long as NSFW content is legal and properly tagged, it can be an entirely opt-in experience (with some default/UI tweaks if it’s not the case already). I understand that people don’t want to see otaku lolichans or whatever, but even on Reddit enabling NSFW could get you a prolapsed anus, a brutal beheading, or any flavor of extreme fetish that has just as much potential to ruin your day. Even as someone who doesn’t seek any of this out, I’d still like to have aggregation of the largest NSFW feeds (which is majority pretty tame by comparison). If there’s a possibility for this stuff to sneak into /m/random or wherever, that can be addressed without defederation.
One of the reasons I joined Kbin is because it isn’t Beehaw, and doesn’t have the mission of curating a family-friendly safe space engineered not to offend anyone, ever. Moderation is necessary to mitigate habitual bad actors and comply with legal standards, but self-imposing a mandate beyond that just creates an endless stream of drama in service of a goal that’s impossible to attain. As the fediverse grows, this kind of controversy will become more and more common as with all social media, and it’s not tenable to try be responsive to the whims of every person or group who wants to impose an agenda or finds their sensibilities violated by this or that community. It fuels conflict, promotes censorship, and incentivizes grandstanding by people who are more concerned with policing the actions of others than contributing constructively to discussions.
Who wants to read a post feed that’s dominated by people arguing about this stuff and calling each other names over the new hot-button moderation issue of the day? How is that any better than Twitter?
Anyone against defederating is seriously messed up. You included.
I don’t know why you feel the need to insult me over trivial bullshit like this, but I can throw that particular one right back at you, just for that.
Obviously because you feel the need to call CP “trivial bullshit”.
Geez, you need to take some fresh air, he didn’t said that. Dont make this place Reddit 2.0 and take the time to think before you type.
It’s pretty black and white when it comes to this stuff. There’s no grey zone. Block the hell out of it, support blocking it, or you condone it.
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I literally did not do that, completely the opposite. You know who’s the greatest homophobes that see weird gay or trans agendas everywhere? Closeted gay people. Your weird mental gymnastics to put me into this sort of corner, even though I and those mods made it very clear that CP is banned, makes me think that you’re a closeted pedophile who thinks acting this way makes him look less suspicious. See how that works out?
Quite the case of projection there.
You are almost there buddy.
You know who’s the greatest homophobes that see weird gay or trans agendas everywhere? Closeted gay people.
I’m pretty sure that’s not actually true.
and now the federation drama begins…
There is nothing dramatic about it. Defederating from problematic instances is nothing new for federated platforms.
Access to content should not be difficulted by puritan views. If people enjoy gore and create an instance about gore in movies showing very explicit (yet fictional) images of dismemberments and stuff in movies it should be banned too because is morally questionable?
If you can’t distinguish between fiction and reality it should be a you problem not the whole instance you are inhabiting problem
What do you think about this? (sorry the article is in Spanish, but there is no English article)
https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ni%C3%B1os_en_la_playa
It’s a painting exposed in an important museum
If you want legally questionable material, gore, or other shit, you’re free to spin up your own instance. Your access to it is not being fettered.
You’re just not entitled to access it using someone else’s website.
The lengths people will go to to defend paedos is striking.
The venn diagram of pedo supporters and alt right is almost a circle.
Paedos should be castrated and thrown into the deepest hole and never leave, as they hurt children. Nobody is defending those people, but drawings are not children, nobody is harmed. That’s an important difference
People who seek out sexual representation of people that look underage are paedos, and those that claim “iT’s JuSt DrAwInGs” are protecting paedos.
This is your argument:
We should ban violent videogames . Everybody know people who play violent videogames are violent. Peolpe claiming “It’S jUsT a GaMe” are protecting violent people
P.S. I hope you don’t like shaved vaginas, btw, people who like shaved genitals are just ill people people who want to see kid-like genitals without any hair i.e. paedos
lmfao, you’re reaching so hard to defend paedos.
I have no idea about the context of that painting, but I don’t think the children are being sexualised in it. The under-age content that will be posted on lemmynsfw (fictional or not) will definitely be sexual in nature, and that is deeply problematic and might also be illegal in several countries. They can do whatever they want with their instance, but the users of kbin.social shouldn’t have to be looking at such content.
lemmynsfw said they don’t allow underage content though. so that’s unrelated to their ruling. their ruling applies to adult content, not underage.
The linked post is saying they will allow non-irl underage-looking content.
That is illegal in Canada.
163.1 (1) In this section, child pornography means
(a) a photographic, film, video or other visual representation, whether or not it was made by electronic or mechanical means,
(i) that shows a person who is or is depicted as being under the age of eighteen years and is engaged in or is depicted as engaged in explicit sexual activity
https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/c-46/section-163.1.html
that applies to people, not drawings.
I’d encourage you to read what I just posted because drawings would fall under “other visual representations”
but the users of kbin.social shouldn’t have to be looking at such content.
Idk, as kbin.social user I was not looking to such content until you mentioned it. And since I don’t follow that instance I will not be looking to such content in the future
You do “follow” that instance because you are part of kbin.social which is federated with it. You could go in and block each of the magazines/threads from there or whatever the term is on Lemmy, and block the users you don’t want to see content from, but kbin.social is federated with lemmynsfw, so that content has the ability to show up in your “all” or “random” feeds unless we defederate -which is the question being asked. So you very well could really l easily have that content in your feed in the best future
You know what you can do if you want to see that content? Subscribe to that instance or an instance that is federated with it. Easy
