Cross-posted from: https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/34117495

[OC]

Original still created by @gedogfx (IG). Title source: “Inkl”

Edit: I’m not on any other social media platforms, so feel free to share this elsewhere if you want

  • Apytele@sh.itjust.works
    172·
    4 days ago

    Me catching up on historical Christian theology on YouTube to help contextualize the spirituality of my youth:

    I’m loving this lecturer’s depth of knowledge on this subject and he’s right that literally every person who knows that religion exists has some kind of theological standpoint whether or not they even believe in a God at all-

    -but I completely disagree that the specific question of divinity is worth even asking let alone debating or worst case scenario creating divisions between people over. This isn’t even me saying I believe in it or not in fact I specifically refuse to engage with that question in any way.

    Debates regarding the divinity of Jesus have been overwhelmingly used throughout history to provide cover for ideologies that both directly contradict the actual words of Jesus and which have caused the suffering and death of millions. “It’s fine that we rape children because we believe in the divinity of Jesus!” The nicene creed ruined one of if not the greatest antiestablishment movements in history and was instrumental in its transformation into itself being the abusive establishment.

    Now, I do understand that this makes me by default non-nicene, but it’s the fact that that binary exists in the first place that I specifically object to. They’re the ones making it an issue for no reason other than to have something to hold over other people’s heads that requires no actual thought or effort. They don’t have to actually debate theology, they’ve ended the discussion there by choosing a fundamentally unprovable premise to hinge their entire argument on. They’ve absolved themselves of expending any effort to better the world because by saying one passage out loud their labor is complete.

    The nicene creed exists for no other reason than to wage ideological and literal wars over so that real good can be ignored or even fought against. It does not improve the world in any way. The nicene creed ruined Christianity.

    Thank you for coming to my TEDTalk.

    • hansolo@lemm.eeEnglish
      8·
      4 days ago

      I made the same journey during COVID, ultimately arriving at a similar place that the Nicene Creed was the first in a long line of obvious retconned political and human decisions. For what is worth, I also feel like it’s in the same vein as most of what Paul did, codifying and standardizing to the detriment of the source material and to the benefit of anyone willing to take charge.

      I’m still genuinely shocked that anyone can read the Gospels and then not see the record-scratch pivot in tone for everything else afterwards. Well, shocked in as far as to then be disappointed at how easily a mess of addenda created something antithetical to a bunch of nebulous good vibes with no clear avenue to monetize it all.

      Which, oddly enough, Buddhism does as well, but owns it as part of the process.

      • Apytele@sh.itjust.works
        3·
        4 days ago

        Bruce Gore, specifically on church history. Seems to be a Presbyterian which imo are usually the biggest nerds but that was what I was looking for anyway ;)

    • regdog@lemmy.world
      1·
      4 days ago

      You sound like you need Satan in your life.

      The satanic temple recognizes that religion has a huge sphere of influence over humanity, and this sphere should not be conceded to theist religions alone. The satanic temple serves as a counter balance to theist religions, and their influence in the world.

      PS: Here is a joke:

      Question: What to do call people who believe that Satan exists?

      Answer:

      Christians

      • Apytele@sh.itjust.works
        1·
        3 days ago

        Nah diehard atheism isn’t really my jam. I’m leaning more towards gnosticism / esotericism. I’m actually fine with the whole Jesus thing I just wanna skip the misogyny and do more chasing capitalists out of churches with whips while getting drunk with hookers. Also I’m actually kinda vibing with the aesthetic of the weird pseudoscientific spiritual shit because I like my placebos to have pretty rocks and starry shit and as an added side bonus it makes mansplainers really irrationally angry and that’s just funny asf. Also technically Christians and Satanists both believe in satanism the same way if you follow the original vein of satan just being the absence of god its just satanists think that’s a good thing and / or the truer nature of the world which is valid they’re just really edgy / pretentious about it and I’m not ready to buy a trilby just yet. I do admire their work in regards to abortion and reclaiming public and civic spaces from religious oppression. I guess that’s the issue though; Satanism is a political stance, I’m more looking for a spiritual philosophy and religious rituals that connect me to a wider community and provide patterns for my mind and body to latch onto for stability and comfort. Satanism doesn’t provide any of that which again, is fine, but not what I’m looking for.

        • regdog@lemmy.world
          1·
          3 days ago

          Whatever works for you. I hope you find a religion that fits you (and does not hurt other people in the process)

    • LandedGentry@lemmy.zipEnglish
      12·
      4 days ago

      I find the debate on the nicene creed fascinating as always, including your take. But where the fuck are you getting “raping kids is ok because we believe in the divinity of Jesus” [sic]?

      Edit: yall fuck the Catholic Church and may they go completely bankrupt and dissolve for their crimes against humanity. I’m just not seeing where that line came from. The church doesn’t justify or defend what priests did, certainly not on based on the belief in Christ’s divinity. That is an absurd claim.