##THE CLIMATE CRISIS IS NOT OUR FAULT, ITS NOT OUR FUCKING DIET’S RESPONSIBILITY TO FIX, GODDAMMIT. STOP TALKING ABOUT OUR “CARBON FOOTPRINT” (a term and concept invented by BP publicists) AND BREAK GODDAMN INDUSTRY INTO PIECES SMALL ENOUGH TO FUCKING FLUSH DOWN THE DRAIN
If every single person went vegetarian, we’d still be in deep shit. And it’s not our previous meat-eating that’s responsible. It’s the companies that have buried, obfuscated, lied, and manipulated everything and everyone for a goddamn century. And they’re still getting away with it with articles like this.
Do you recommend we all give up and not try to do what we can with our own agency? Is that how you live your life, have you given up?
The “personal responsibility for climate change” angle is a distraction. In the grand scheme of things, meat eating makes little difference. It’s the burning of fossil fuels by cargo ships, cruise ships, airliners, private jets, and by governments and militaries.
We’re not going to make a dent in climate change by not eating beef. We need to lobby and fight for extensive regulations on pollution and for investment into green energy generation.
An article like this is just a distraction.
Okay let’s hit the meat and fuel companies where it hurts: their wallets
Stop buying meat and fuel.
Look, I get that logic, I really do.
And do it. I’m not trying to stop anyone from going vegetarian at all. But think of how many people need to change before your not buying meat actually has an effect. Because, think about it: you don’t buy any meat, but the store you shop at doesn’t change their order. If you went full vegan today, the grocery store would still stock the exact same amount of those products.
My point isn’t that telling people to go vegetarian is wrong. Not at all, it’s a great thing.
My point is, it’s thinking way too small and it’s actively changing the tone of the conversation. And that change was literally crafted by industry publicists, drawing attention away from the true culprits. The waters are muddier.
If every article and every study that came out telling individuals how to change their lives and sacrifice in order to save the environment were, instead, about how 100 companies are responsible for 70% of emissions, how they had internal studies a hundred years ago about how their product was altering the environment, about how they’ve escaped change via lobbying and misinformation, the pressure wouldn’t be spread out—this conversation wouldn’t be happening. Our lifestyle changes would be exactly as important as they should be in this conversation: a nice addition. Nowhere near the focus. Instead, I see way more articles focusing on how we can all collectively change to fight the monstrous beast that is climate change. That’s telling people to fire bottle rockets at an attacking Air Force. It’s pissing in the wind. When there are white armies out there that get to write off doing shit because it’s on those people.
Again, changing your life for the good of the environment is a great thing. Doing it is admirable. But it’s also privilege-restrictive. Living an emission-reductive lifestyle is literally not possible for a lot of people. Just like being poor is expensive, being poor forces horrible carbon emission decisions on people. I haven’t crunched the numbers, (no one has) but if every privileged-enough person changed, would that be enough? Probably not. More and more people are financially restricted, and talking about eco-friendly lifestyle choices like it’s all about how much you care is incredibly unfair.
But that’s all after the fact of this being a tactic invented by the oil/gas industry to take pressure off of the few companies that literally are responsible for—and that could have a huge effect on—climate change.
This is playing marbles in a hurricane and yelling at the kid who is trying to blow the marbles out of place—is that contribution actually changing things? Sure, a little. But there is a fucking hurricane and any time spent talking about changing that kid’s behavior is time not spent talking about the hurricane.
But think of how many people need to change before your not buying meat actually has an effect
But there’s every chance that I’m the tipping point between one more order of meat from the supplier, and two. That I’m the drop in the bucket that saves a cow’s life. And as for fuel, well I’m definitely having an effect on the environment, because I’m avoiding the use of moles upon moles of carbon atoms. It’s not big, but it’s there. We need big, but we also need there. It ALL matters.
And besides, I’m not just a consequentialist. I’m a virtue ethicist too. I can honestly say that I’m not part of the problem, and that feels good. That’s more worth it to me than delighting in eating the flesh of slaves. And knowing that other people are part of the problem and they think eating slaves can be justfied by some excuse, well that’s disgusting and I don’t like those people. It’s morally bankrupt. I do not like slavers.
If every article and every study that came out telling individuals how to change their lives and sacrifice in order to save the environment were, instead, about how 100 companies are responsible for 70% of emissions, how they had internal studies a hundred years ago about how their product was altering the environment, about how they’ve escaped change via lobbying and misinformation, the pressure wouldn’t be spread out—this conversation wouldn’t be happening
That’s what the conversation has BEEN for the last 5-10 years. The 00s and early 10s, you’re right, it was all on the big companies and they used propaganda to delay us looking at them. But today, everyone knows the government and the corporations are to blame, and does it change their votes? Not really. We are already having the conversation about big business and it’s not working. And even if it did work, we don’t have the same luxuries we had in the 00s. In the 00s, climate change could have been solved by big companies taking responsibility. That’s not true anymore. In the 20s, it takes EVERYONE working to save the world. And since I’m part of everyone, I’m gonna work.
I agree that we need regulation. But I think you also discount the effects of individual consumption.
In the long-ish term, the animal farming indistry has to go. It cannot be made sustainable, no matter how you regulate industry. It’s just a waste of resources. So at some point you as an individual have to adapt to a vegan diet, either by choice or because there is no alternative. What will it be? Do you want to stop eating meat the moment it is outlawed?
People who cling to eating meat nowadays actively oppose regulation. Otherwise they couln’t eat meat. There is still a demand. We need both regulation to end animal farming and convince individual consumers, that they have to become vegans. It’s the masses who have the most power. If veganism came from the majority population, it would be far easier to regulate industry.
Would you support enforced veganism, and jailing anybody who eats or prepares meat?
Why does everything have to go to the extreme end of straight to jail?
The post to which I replied said:
So at some point you as an individual have to adapt to a vegan diet, either by choice or because there is no alternative.
Do you want to stop eating meat the moment it is outlawed?
We need both regulation to end animal farming and convince individual consumers, that they have to become vegans
If they want “regulations” to “end” animal farming then I just want to be clear that they support imprisoning people who prepare or eat meat. They went to the extreme of jail without mentioning the word jail.
Mate, it’s illegal for teenagers to buy R rated movies and I’ve never heard of anyone going to jail for it. Why can’t meat be like that?
No, I don’t support jail for anyone, because it’s a bad way to solve crime. I think anyone who eats meat should be sentenced to something productive like community service, or therapy to get to the bottom of why they think they have the right to kill others.
I would refuse that community service and therapy. What would happen then?
Well then under communism, you wouldn’t be invited to any of the cool parties, and you’d be refused service at most non-essential places like restaurants and gyms. People would think you’re a weirdo.
Stopping the climate crisis requires a greater reduction in carbon emissions than is physically possible if every individual were to give up their car and meat, and every mining, energy, and transport company were to be dissolved. The good ending requires 110% of EVERYONE working together.
So if we want to avoid the very worst ending, EVERYONE needs to put in their maximum effort. We need to end pollution at the governmental level, and we need to end pollution at the personal level on our way there. Everything we can possibly do isn’t good enough, and that means we need to do everything we possibly can and cross our fingers. There are no more excuses left, for anyone, corporate or personal.
